I just remembered Jung talking about the first moments of when falling asleep and how in that state, the compensatory aspect of the dreamworld turns our waking world upside down, which in many ways makes the first images that appear in the twilight very confusing as they seem to be so contrarian to what we may have just been doing.
A semipermeable membrane is what I experience rather than porous, but that would be a very interesting discussion wether or not the membrane is semipermeable or porous. This woud revolutionize our world view. Jung touches on the subject in his autobiography and I appreciate his less flowery aproach of coolheaded speculation that the other side may not be perfect, and may even contain polarity. That is true Msytical punk rock stuff, very different from so many mother/father complex driven modern therapists who try everything to conjure some imaginary image of eternal love in their clients. Mostly my reverie is me being an ox waiting outside the city gates.
We've been practicing loving kindness meditation intensively in a class on Resilience, and it's really changed the nature of the liminal space between sleep and waking for me. I'm starting to get direct communication, answers to questions. It's been a process! How have others used a meditation practice to engage the reverie practice?
In the drama of the soul, the author of which we do not know and we ourselves play a supporting role in, surprises us during the day, through cross memories, as an incursion into our consciousness.
Our ancestors, the whole world history is inscribed as a precipitate in the reality of the soul.
What we do and what we do not do can be erased from the soul itself, which does not embrace the past.
What we do or do not do, we will open the soul in the next dream to own knowledge acquisition.
Reverie is the state for which one strives when entering sleep consciously, using the WILD technique (Wake Induced Lucid Dream). Deepening and enriching the sensory experience of hypnogogic imagery with a focus that is detached, yet conscious and interested, allows the content of the imagery to take on a life of its own, or express the message of the unconscious.
Later, the psyche may be understood better, and may be seen and understood from a psychological viewpoint. But in the present, while the experience is immanent, reverie helps to make the experience itself to happen. Both perspectives may enrich one’s life, as they have in mine. In my initial experiments, I didn’t know I was performing the technique of active imagination. On review of my journal, I recovered a wealth of information about myself.
Mark, thank you for interjecting the notion that ritual or ceremony can also be the response soul requires. We know that soul understands the language of ritual, for her a preferred language. In my psychotherapy practice I am always pleased to see the gift that ritual can bring to a difficult situation, allowing us to bypass consciousness and still find healing. This might be necessary, for instance, when the wounding is so deep that consciousness is not possible. I so appreciate your response.
I don't know, when I think of reverie I think of Eponine's bittersweet song "On My Own" from the musical "Les Miserables." Miss America contestants used to love this song because it combined vocal gymnastics with the opportunity to emote tragically for the judges:
On my own
Pretending he's beside me
All alone
I walk with him till morning
Without him
I feel his arms around me
And when I lose my way I close my eyes
And he has found me
In the rain the pavement shines like silver
All the lights are misty in the river
In the darkness, the trees are full of starlight
And all I see is him and me forever and forever
And I know it's only in my mind
That I'm talking to myself and not to him
And although I know that he is blind
Still I say, there's a way for us
I love him
But when the night is over
He is gone
The river's just a river
Without him
The world around me changes
The trees are bare and everywhere
The streets are full of strangers
I love him
But every day I'm learning
All my life
I've only been pretending
Without me
His world will go on turning
A world that's full of happiness
That I have never known
I love him
I love him
I love him
But only on my own
Things ended poorly for Eponine. From the perspective of economics the return on her investment was negative. Unless you can make the products of your reverie manifest themselves in real life you're still just a lonely street urchin wandering cold and barefoot through Paris.
Mary Harrell > Holly EschFebruary 7, 2015 at 10:39am
On the idea you-Holly Esch-pose, "Unless you can make the products of your reverie manifest themselves in real life you're still just a lonely street urchin wandering cold and barefoot through Paris." Yes, over time, one is called to eventually bring the rich loam of reverie into the world.
One way to think of this is that reverie is in the realm of the feminine, being fluid, rich in possibility, at the borders of worlds; reverie eventually leads to a call for the balance found in masculine embodiment. To explain: This conversation was begun in conjunction with Robert Romanyshyn and Brian Tracy speaking for the cultivation of a poetic sensibility. We might consider that Romanyshyn's forays into the space of reverie found expression in his new publication, Leaning Toward the Poet : Eavesdropping on the Poetry of Everyday Life. Reverie is embodied, in this example, in the act of actually finding a poem (or collection of poems) framed within its own lines and presented in a public forum-Robert's book. That's what I mean by masculine embodiment. None of us does well unless we move in harmony between masculine and feminine domains. I speak more of this at maryharrellphd.com Thanks Holly for your comments.
Mark Sipowicz > Mary HarrellFebruary 7, 2015 at 1:49pm
I like your quote shared here Mary and also your line of movement towards manifesting, embodiment, and taking actions upon receiving these numinous gifts from our jaunts into reverie. I often think, in almost comic terms of the anecdotes regarding Toni Wolffe's dedication to "doing something" about her patients' dreams. The image of her barring the door to her consulting room from the returning patient who had unwittingly avoided or forgotten to do something about the dream discussed in the last session is often a strong reminder to me and inducement to action. But, I would interject that the doing and embodying can also just be a ritual or ceremony acknowledging and enacting the image. Here of course, the action is for the sake of alerting the psyche that the image has been seen and received. It is said by some and experienced by myself, quite often, that if these strong images (with aspects of synchronicity and ancestral messaging) are not adaquately mirrored back in a ritual, psyche can continue sending its messages, and in the worst case begin sending them in the form of symptoms, external events, accidents and eruptions.
That being said, whether consciously or not, Romanyshyn's publication of "Leaning Towards the Poet" is as you say an embodied action that draws from the fluidity of reverie and gives form. In my way of thinking, the publication is a dramatic and significant ritual of carrying the images from the fluidity of the stream to the community, where the miositure and movement of the reverie can have a second life in its readers.
Appreciate the dialogue here and the immensely provocative conversation heard on the call.
Replies
I just remembered Jung talking about the first moments of when falling asleep and how in that state, the compensatory aspect of the dreamworld turns our waking world upside down, which in many ways makes the first images that appear in the twilight very confusing as they seem to be so contrarian to what we may have just been doing.
A semipermeable membrane is what I experience rather than porous, but that would be a very interesting discussion wether or not the membrane is semipermeable or porous. This woud revolutionize our world view. Jung touches on the subject in his autobiography and I appreciate his less flowery aproach of coolheaded speculation that the other side may not be perfect, and may even contain polarity. That is true Msytical punk rock stuff, very different from so many mother/father complex driven modern therapists who try everything to conjure some imaginary image of eternal love in their clients. Mostly my reverie is me being an ox waiting outside the city gates.
We've been practicing loving kindness meditation intensively in a class on Resilience, and it's really changed the nature of the liminal space between sleep and waking for me. I'm starting to get direct communication, answers to questions. It's been a process! How have others used a meditation practice to engage the reverie practice?
We dream during the day as well as at night.
In the drama of the soul, the author of which we do not know and we ourselves play a supporting role in, surprises us during the day, through cross memories, as an incursion into our consciousness.
Our ancestors, the whole world history is inscribed as a precipitate in the reality of the soul.
What we do and what we do not do can be erased from the soul itself, which does not embrace the past.
What we do or do not do, we will open the soul in the next dream to own knowledge acquisition.
Answer to:
Thích Nhất Hạnh
It is time
that every human
the indivisible human dignity respects
his dreams
the mouthpiece
theirs, the daily training
takes seriously for inspection
for the better
acts accordingly
the earth
the nature
we are nature
will also be
when we are no longer
survive without humans
Reverie is the state for which one strives when entering sleep consciously, using the WILD technique (Wake Induced Lucid Dream). Deepening and enriching the sensory experience of hypnogogic imagery with a focus that is detached, yet conscious and interested, allows the content of the imagery to take on a life of its own, or express the message of the unconscious.
Later, the psyche may be understood better, and may be seen and understood from a psychological viewpoint. But in the present, while the experience is immanent, reverie helps to make the experience itself to happen. Both perspectives may enrich one’s life, as they have in mine. In my initial experiments, I didn’t know I was performing the technique of active imagination. On review of my journal, I recovered a wealth of information about myself.
Mark, thank you for interjecting the notion that ritual or ceremony can also be the response soul requires. We know that soul understands the language of ritual, for her a preferred language. In my psychotherapy practice I am always pleased to see the gift that ritual can bring to a difficult situation, allowing us to bypass consciousness and still find healing. This might be necessary, for instance, when the wounding is so deep that consciousness is not possible. I so appreciate your response.
On my own
Pretending he's beside me
All alone
I walk with him till morning
Without him
I feel his arms around me
And when I lose my way I close my eyes
And he has found me
In the rain the pavement shines like silver
All the lights are misty in the river
In the darkness, the trees are full of starlight
And all I see is him and me forever and forever
And I know it's only in my mind
That I'm talking to myself and not to him
And although I know that he is blind
Still I say, there's a way for us
I love him
But when the night is over
He is gone
The river's just a river
Without him
The world around me changes
The trees are bare and everywhere
The streets are full of strangers
I love him
But every day I'm learning
All my life
I've only been pretending
Without me
His world will go on turning
A world that's full of happiness
That I have never known
I love him
I love him
I love him
But only on my own
Things ended poorly for Eponine. From the perspective of economics the return on her investment was negative. Unless you can make the products of your reverie manifest themselves in real life you're still just a lonely street urchin wandering cold and barefoot through Paris.
On the idea you-Holly Esch-pose, "Unless you can make the products of your reverie manifest themselves in real life you're still just a lonely street urchin wandering cold and barefoot through Paris." Yes, over time, one is called to eventually bring the rich loam of reverie into the world.
One way to think of this is that reverie is in the realm of the feminine, being fluid, rich in possibility, at the borders of worlds; reverie eventually leads to a call for the balance found in masculine embodiment. To explain: This conversation was begun in conjunction with Robert Romanyshyn and Brian Tracy speaking for the cultivation of a poetic sensibility. We might consider that Romanyshyn's forays into the space of reverie found expression in his new publication, Leaning Toward the Poet : Eavesdropping on the Poetry of Everyday Life. Reverie is embodied, in this example, in the act of actually finding a poem (or collection of poems) framed within its own lines and presented in a public forum-Robert's book. That's what I mean by masculine embodiment. None of us does well unless we move in harmony between masculine and feminine domains. I speak more of this at maryharrellphd.com Thanks Holly for your comments.
I like your quote shared here Mary and also your line of movement towards manifesting, embodiment, and taking actions upon receiving these numinous gifts from our jaunts into reverie. I often think, in almost comic terms of the anecdotes regarding Toni Wolffe's dedication to "doing something" about her patients' dreams. The image of her barring the door to her consulting room from the returning patient who had unwittingly avoided or forgotten to do something about the dream discussed in the last session is often a strong reminder to me and inducement to action. But, I would interject that the doing and embodying can also just be a ritual or ceremony acknowledging and enacting the image. Here of course, the action is for the sake of alerting the psyche that the image has been seen and received. It is said by some and experienced by myself, quite often, that if these strong images (with aspects of synchronicity and ancestral messaging) are not adaquately mirrored back in a ritual, psyche can continue sending its messages, and in the worst case begin sending them in the form of symptoms, external events, accidents and eruptions.
That being said, whether consciously or not, Romanyshyn's publication of "Leaning Towards the Poet" is as you say an embodied action that draws from the fluidity of reverie and gives form. In my way of thinking, the publication is a dramatic and significant ritual of carrying the images from the fluidity of the stream to the community, where the miositure and movement of the reverie can have a second life in its readers.
Appreciate the dialogue here and the immensely provocative conversation heard on the call.
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