• Good point.  I don't think they would be effecting the collective but I do think they along with the "false memory fanatics" are somehow interfering with the ability of others to achieve some enlightenment and to contribute to that collective.  How that jives with time being an illusion I don't know.

  • First, going back to the original question, in the context of the collective unconscious, is there such a thing as a false memory? Within the collective unconscious, no, for all human events are physical manifestations of the human condition. Within the context of a personal, individual's life of experience, the answer can be yes. 

    Second, then how do you define delusion? Gerard combining his experience as "fear," delusion," and "haunted'" yet the fear has more to do with what others think rather than the actual, personal experience that Gerard entitles delusional. My question is, what is haunting in the experience? Fear of judgement by others or the message the experience has yet to reveal due to the fear of human judgment?

    • I came to the same conclusions regarding the original question.  At the time I was contemplating the consequences of neuroscientists implanting false memories, as well as what appears to be a concerted effort to convince the masses the memory dissociation can not occur and all autobiographical memories are fanciful.  I was pleasantly surprised to see this coming from the new Pope just a day or two ago:

      Pope Francis said, “Each of us can ask ourselves: what is my memory? That of the Lord, who saves me, or that of the garlic and onions of slavery? With what memory do I satiate my soul? The Father tells us: ‘I have fed you with manna which you did not know.’ Let us recover memory,” said Pope Francis. “This is the task,” he continued, “to recover memory; and learn to recognize the false bread that deceives and corrupts, because it is the result of selfishness, self and sin.”

      He sounds to be a huge believer in Jungian psychoanalysis.  LOL

      As to the second issue perhaps it is better described as a fear of misunderstanding fed in part by my own inability to understand.  My thoughts with regarding to the collective unconscious are pleasant enough.  My thoughts with regard to our present "reality" are somewhat disturbing. 



      • Just occurred to me that false memory creation has been going on for generations, just not along neuroscientific lines. How many times has history been rewritten and taught in our schools to generations not old enough to have their own memories of events? This type of neural reprogramming has a long and multicultural history.

      • If neuroscientists are human themselves, then can they really implant anything that's not in the collective unconscious already? If we're all working off the same template how possible is it to implant something completely new?
  • The fear of being thought of as delusional has haunted me my entire life.

  • My sense is that the collective is composed of individual minds without separations for time or space.  They all exists as one and all share one identity but each mind also maintains it own identity.  Has it ever been described in this way?

    • The collective unconscious - so far as we can say anything about it at all  - appears to consist of mythological motifs or primordial images, for which reason the myths of all nations are its real exponents. In fact, the whole of mythology could be taken as a sort of projection of the collective unconscious... We can therefore study the collective unconscious in two ways, either in mythology or in the analysis of the individual. (From The Structure of the Psyche, CW 8, par. 325.)

      • If there is a moment when a definition from from a dictionary or a book doesn't help much, this is it. When I participated in the webinar Building the Future with New Global Mythology, I felt uncomfortable with my contribution and was "lucky" that the microphone had stopped working. Speaking in tongues shouldn't be recorded. :-) It seems to me that in the edited question Gerard relied on something from personal experience. I'll save the link to this topic and write something much, much later.

  • Kind of, sort of. The edited question for this topic is whether a person can tap into something more conscious, something that remembers both the past and the future. For instance, as I was imagining my Batman story I didn't at the beginning notice that the actor's name has a meaning. It's a similar situation when I was looking for the meaning behind the Alliance member Charlotte Knoflicek. Variations of the name Charles means "manly" and Google translate translates Knoflicek into "stud", a semi-vulgar/slang word for "manly". Something similar has happened to someone else who named his/her (I know the gender, but it's not important here) alter ego after a character from a book without knowing how much will his/her life resemble to the story from that book. So: either

    a) in the collective unconscious there is nothing but goo and tendencies to think and behave in specific ways, there's nothing mystical to look for,

    b) there is some reality behind this kind of stories, but a person should be careful and patient with it and not let the ego and inflation mess it up,

    c) both, every situation is a story for itself, or


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