Comments

• 

  Willi Paul July 7, 2012 at 11:55am

  Hi Scott - A host of great issues in your words this AM. As a person without training in deep psychology, I believe that I am both free from, and limited to, many folks here. When you say that " I understand exactly how epic religious myths are created..." please realize that I do not understand your POV.  

   

  I readily admit that my journey to you and your colleagues have been more akin to a "mystical visionary experience and spiritual quest." Something that Joseph Campbell Foundations' Stephen Gerringer told me is bliss. Bliss is messy and uncomfortable to me but I embrace it as best as I can and I trek with an open heart with my bag of symbols and myths - naively engineering common ground and illumination.

   

  Who will move the rock?
• 

  Scott Lampman July 7, 2012 at 11:35am

  Willi, I understand exactly how epic religious myths are created. You may be able to use that model, to create a myth that suits your purpose.

  1) Fact: There would be no such thing, as the burning bush story, or the myth of Moses the redeemer, without the vision on the mountan of Horeb that started it all off. That vision came from the unconscious. Likewise with Buddism, it would not exist if it were not for Siddhartha's vision under the bohdi tree, which also came from the unconscious, in other words, they didn't consciously make it up. 

  2) Nobody (on this website) is saying myths were created by non-humans. Obviously, the great myths of the past were created by wise men. What is not so well known, is that the great myths were created by wise men, intimately familiar with the mystics visionary experience and spiritual quest, and the different psychological potentials that may or may not spring forth from it, i.e., the 'different levels of illumination', as Joseph Campbell would say. The wise men used symbols and metaphors to describe that experience. 

   
• 

  Willi Paul July 7, 2012 at 10:04am

  CG: "socio-cultural interaction," yes, that's my POV, too...

     

               -- from an "armchair depth psychologist?!"
• 

  Willi Paul July 6, 2012 at 4:55pm

  Robert Quinn - I just wish you could see my smile. Your spirited "rebuttal"? Is most refreshing. While not a god or goddess, I would have to disagree with the popular assertion that myths are written by non-humans! I have 5 different and documented methods in my tool kit to write myths.
  
  I strongly agree with you here: "... how we grapple with and are shaped by the process." This is true no matter if we are creating new myths as a solo agent or in community. This process is sacred and alchemical - and rife with new symbols for a new age!
• 

  Robert Quinn July 6, 2012 at 4:17pm

  I don't think that any of us can create a "NEW!!!" myth. We can probably suggest or throw out some ideas which might then be picked up by others who might do something to them and then let them sit until someone else kicks it or reshapes it a bit. After years and years of this, when it is totally unrecognizable as the idea that we initially started with and having been tried out and reshaped by life and culture and everything else that may come into play in the living of life, then, maybe, a new myth will have been born.

   

  We live in a world where we think that we can do everything. Some things, however, can't be shaped by the hands of the human beast no matter how much we want to think we can. To think otherwise is to try to put ourselves on a seat next to or in place of god or God. And some things cannot be accomplished in a weekend or two. The story of the tower of Babel is one example that warns against this as does the story of Icarus. Also, it seems that once we have the product created, some would want other people to come and flock to it since, in our minds, we had THE  ANSWER. I think this was why Jung once said "Thank God I'm Jung and not a Jungian." 

   

  I don't think that the final product is the important thing here but rather how we grapple with and are shaped by the process. Just consider us all slightly pregnant with many more months before our due date. And as for how long we'll have to be pregnant with this desire for a new global mythology, none of us know. It's not something for which we know the length of the pregnancy. We may not even see the conclusion of the process since we are not gods and goddesses.
• 

  Willi Paul July 6, 2012 at 2:27pm

  Christian – it might be wise to collaborate and agree on some definitions as we address your excellent thesis. I have started this over-due process below:

   

  1. Symbol: Some potential sacred permaculture symbols include –

   

  - Diversity (Soil)
  - Growth (Seeds)
  - Harvest (Basket)
  - Transformation (Fire + Smoke)
  - Stewardship (Compost Pile)
  - Localization (Community Well)

   

  2. Archetype:

   

  3. World View:

   

  4. Natural: Not man-made or found only in Nature

   

  5. Crucial and universal concerns: including climate change, war, corp. control of seeds, lack of clean water, environmental justice

   

  6. (hierarchy of) The System:

   

  7. New Myth (in or outside of the unconscious): New Global Mythology (NGM) uses most of the functionality in the definition of  myth but adds several important updates from the classic definitions of myth in that classic Norse, Greek and Roman are seen as ineffectual in this over-mediated, unsacred, and Nature-at-risk age. NGM also facilitates the creation of new myths by both individuals and groups with documented schemes. New Mythology, whether in the form of new poems, stories, or songs, requires a new spiritual search engine to go with the Internet.
• 

  Willi Paul July 4, 2012 at 10:38am

  Christian: "...that which arises out of our unconscious is what brings about mythical structure/elements, and I really don't see how that process can be avoided, or perhaps sidestepped is a better view." Let us then investigate the unconscious and these mythical structure/elements! Are you pointing us towards archetypes?

   

  
• 

  Willi Paul July 4, 2012 at 9:31am

  I think that the internet and digital storytelling has changed that organic equation, Christian. Now, "somebody" has released 23 new myths in the space of ~ 365 days and the world to many is in deep peril. Do you really believe that we have enough time to share and evolve the mythic stories necessary to our survival? A huge paradox in this time-collapsed, digital generation? ;-)
• 

  Willi Paul July 3, 2012 at 2:54pm

  Hi Robert - Did something besides human beings write the classic myths? If so, I'd love to hear your take on this key issue. In my workshop, we create & discuss elements for new myths. I ask all who attend to retreat and vision and finalize their myth. This is a very nascent process, indeed. 

  As to your concern on the New Global Mythology Group and our relative staying power, well,... time will tell. I would relay that I continue to blog in support at occupyoakland.org and hope to do a work shop for them in August. They are one of the few rich and fuzzy resources for future myths.
• 

  Robert Quinn July 3, 2012 at 2:04pm

  Here's my problem with this whole thing of "creating" a new myth. Do we, flawed human beings that we are, create the myth or does it grow organically from life or some such entity?

   

  It's much like the reason why Occupy did not work in my opinion. It wasn't natural. You could see where this was added to placate one group and that for another. It's goals were good but it didn't work as a natural unit. And taking time off for the winter holidays was truly the death knell of a group that had no idea what to do next.